Scott's Thoughts - The Chat, Phones and More!

[Scott Greczkowski]

Before I start my thoughts I would like to say a few Thank Yous!

First thank you to everyone! In only 2 months and 4 days we have broken the 1,000 member mark! Never in my wildest dreams did I expect SatelliteGuys.US to get so big so quick!

Thank you to those who have donated to keep us FREE, as the people who have donated know our costs have gone up greatly since when we first launch just 2 months ago.

If your thinking of donating THANK YOU, we could use the support especially at this time as I am working on something that will greatly increase our bandwidth costs.

As many of you know we do make money from SatelliteGuysStore.COM / DishStore.NET however we have not received anything yet from this venture (but hope to soon!)

Now on to my commentary.

First my thoughts on last night's Charlie Chat...

(Gump mode on) My Mama always said... "if you don't have anything nice to say, then don't say anything at all." So taking mama's advice, that's all I got to say about that

Second as you may have noticed many members have received notices in the mail to plug their phone lines into their receivers. This has caused an uproar.

I didn't really think to much of it until last night after the Charlie Chat, when I got an email from one of my contacts, this email contained a document for Dish Retailers about the 322 and 522 receivers. A paragraph caught my eye... It read as follows...

Please note, each DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 dual tuner receiver requires a constant phone line connection. Customers who do not have a phone line continually connected to their DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 receiver will have to pay a monthly programming access 4.99 per receiver.

Now when I thought about this some more and factored in the phone line letters being sent out something HUGE popped into my mind.

Now understand this is 100% PURE SPECULATION ON MY PART none of what I am going to say has been confirmed by anyone.

If I put the pieces of the puzzle together correctly, I believe that Dish Network will be dropping the additional outlet fees on all receivers which are plugged into a phone line!

Read the above quote from the Retailer Document. Receivers which are NOT continually plugged into a phone line will be charged a programming access fee (additional receiver fee) of $4.99 per receiver.

In doing this Dish Network could serve a severe blow to DirecTV and Digital Cable (Digital Cable charges up to $9 a month for additional Digital outlets!)

This would be good for most consumers as they could save a good amount of money on their monthly bills. If a user did not want to hook up their phone lines they could continue to pay the $4.95 a month additional receiver fee.

This is good for Dish Network because now people wanting multiple rooms of service would choose Dish over DirecTV or Digital Cable and Dish Network would also recover money lost from customers who have filled up their smart cards with PPV purchases yet have never hooked a phone line to their units so that the purchases could be recorded and properly billed.

This also makes the new DVOD fees more palatable, Dish would rather have their customers in DVR units then standard settops because DVR customers have less churn.

From my standpoint it's a win win for everyone.

Again I will say that all the above it just pure speculation on my part. But looking at the facts and benefits the pieces of the puzzle do fit together nicely.

Lastly if you have been reading here over the past two month you will notice that I have been saying December will be a big month for Dish. After last nights chat I got a few messages from some of my contacts about the chat and all of them seem to say that December will be the month to watch. Now sometimes people call me the eternal optimist, but knowing whats coming in Equipment and a good idea of whats coming in programmings I believe that Decembers Charlie Chat will be a holiday treat for all. (I hope I am right)

Anyways that's my thought's for this month, now let's hear yours!

 

[lapplegate]

Quote: Please note, each DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 dual tuner receiver requires a constant phone line connection. Customers who do not have a phone line continually connected to their DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 receiver will have to pay a monthly programming access 4.99 per receiver.

Scott,
Thanks for the info (and hope).

Is it possible that they are going the other way? By that I mean, could they plan on charging an additional $4.99 for the second tuner unless it is connected?

Larry

 

[rad]

Scott, I hope you're correct about the mirroring fee being dropped, but frankly I don't see that happening. I think that Dish has just decided to enforce a provision in the customer agreement to enhance their revenue stream buy cutting off the folks that have been cheating. I think this is just making sure that folks know about the requirement loud a clear before making the commitment.

 

[dmodemd]

They make too much money on additional receiver fees to just drop them. I think it is more likely to be the following:

On all NEW receivers, if they are NOT plugged into a phone line you get the additional charge.
On all NEW DVRs you get the DVR fee except for everything pak.

They will probably do it for just "new" receivers as they did with the DVRs. This will also create an incentive for people to upgrade "legacy" receivers to DVRs.

Since most new receivers will be DVRs they will retain most of this revenue while promoting more people to get everything pak.

Lee

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Good feedback so far.

Let's hope Dish is watching this one, perhaps they can comment on it tommorow on the Retailer Tech Chat.

 

[rad]

I would like to see the DVR fee schedule changed to see it based on the total amount of charges on your account vs. the current structure. I don't have the AEP plan but my bill is higher then that package due to other subscriptions. At least make the plan the same as DirecTV's TIVO plan where the charge is by the account and not by the receiver.

 

[jerryez]

Scott, you are the eternal optimist! You are down on Dish one minute and bragging about them the next.

I wonder how the average John Doe who watches a Charlie Chat perceives it?

 

[dbronstein]

Something else to consider with the phoneline requirement is that if your DVR is hooked up, they can download your viewing data and habits just like Tivo does. Then they can sell this data and use that revenue to make up for losing the additional outlet charge. If you're DVR isn't plugged in, they can't get your data, so they charge you to make up for it, and the charge is an incentive to get more people to plug them in.

Dennis

 

[A_Noland]

I bet they just charge the 4.99 for the second tuner in the 322/522 if you don't have it hooked up.

 

[wcswett]

Please note, each DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 dual tuner receiver requires a constant phone line connection. Customers who do not have a phone line continually connected to their DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 receiver will have to pay a monthly programming access 4.99 per receiver.

If I put the pieces of the puzzle together correctly, I believe that Dish Network will be dropping the additional outlet fees on all receivers which are plugged into a phone line!

That's way too good to be true. I believe they will start turning off receivers that aren't plugged into phone jacks, or threatening to charge customers one additional full account for each additional receiver not plugged into a phone line. Afterall, they just won a large judgement against a company for account stacking, so they're armed with legal precedent now.

--- WCS (five receivers, all phone lined up)

 

[David_Levin]

I bet they just charge the 4.99 for the second tuner in the 322/522 if you don't have it hooked up.

I'm with you. The rule is that exra receivers require a phone connection. A 322/522 is a primary + extra receiver in a single box.

If either DTV or E* drop the extra receiver fee, the other would have to follow suit.

But, I don't envision either giving up the $$$.

 

[Bill R]

Now understand this is 100% PURE SPECULATION ON MY PART none of what I am going to say has been confirmed by anyone.

If I put the pieces of the puzzle together correctly, I believe that Dish Network will be dropping the additional outlet fees on all receivers which are plugged into a phone line!!

Scott,

I don't think you put the pieces together at all. What you are seeing is a grab for more money if the customer can't (or won't) plug in their phone line. I'm saying that they are not even considering dropping the receiver fee.

With more and more people moving to wireless, this could be a BIG mistake for DISH. The phone industry is changing and DISH should be changing with it. They need some other way to verify account information.

My thoughts are that they want the phone line so that they can collect and sell our viewing information as TiVo is doing. "Data collection" is getting to be a big business for cable companies (with digital services) and there is much money to be made from OUR viewing habits and I think that DISH is looking to take advantage of that. A cable company engineer told me that the cable companies get a couple of cents per customer per month for the data they sell. Given DISH's millions of customers that is a lot of money that DISH could get in the future.

DISH is starting to make some really big mistakes in the marketplace and I think that is the reason that their quarterly numbers did not meet Wall Street's expectations and their stock is off a lot today.

 

[Mark Sorensen]

Nice speculation.... now, time for my 100% pure speculation:

I also do NOT believe that they are about to drop Additional Receiver fees for those who connect them to proper phone lines….. That would be a huge drop in revenue. and obviously reduce average revenue per unit.... All, when in reality they ARE subsidizing the cost of those receivers (even at full retail price)....I do not see it happening....

As I think is clear to all, there are a few main reasons why (I think) they want those phone line connected:
1) Impulse Pay Per View SALES REVENUE.
2) Coming interactive features and, SALES REVENUE.
3) "Account Stacking" (they would like to confirm that all those receivers are actually in the same home.)
4) Possibly some of that recon on who watches what...though, I think that this is a distant 4th place…..

And, I put those in the order in which I believe them to be important.

I think that the idea of dropping the additional receiver fee on the 322/522’s when connected to a phone line is primarily for reasons #1 & #2 above…..

It is unfortunate that there are so many issues that frustrate this effort. Such as the fact that people are moving away from land based phone service by the millions. And, that all too frequently there is not a phone line connection at receiver locations, along with aesthetic and economic factors that resist their installation…..

.

 

[minnow]

With all due respect Scott, your puzzle is a few pieces short of the big picture. There's no way that E* is going to drop those receiver fee's. Like others have said, what E* is likely to do is charge an additional $4.95 on top of the standard $4.95 for the 322 and 522 if it's not hooked up to a phone. I just can't believe that the number of individuals out there that are sharing a single billing address with multiple receivers in others homes is that big of problem and would offset the loss of additional receive fee's. And I agree 100 % with Bill R. in that E* is making a very serious miscalculation on individuals dropping the landline based phone service. With the FCC today implementing the phone portability program, you are going to see many, many individuals using their old land line phone number and jumping to cell service exclusively. As usual E* is located just behind the technology 8 ball.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Actually I did this posting to encourage some good roundtable thought.

And it seemed to work, people are putting some good thought into this phone line thing. And they are all being civil to each other.

Good ideas and thoughts all!!

 

[David_Levin]

When puch comes to shove I doubt either E* or DTV will drop anyone because they don't have a landline. In the future this would mean way to many unhappy customers.

They'll either figure out another way, or charge a fee for having to manually call and verify location ID's.

I suppose they could also refuse to mirror receivers, but they outcry would just be too great (especially from the high $$$ customers who they don't want to lose).

Have we herd from anyone who got "the letter" and doesn't have a landline?

 

[Guest]

Seems like a money grab to me too.

1. Requre receiver/phone connection.
2. ?????
3. Profit.

Bah.

 

[Stargazer]

According to the meeting in Charleston tonight they said that the 322 receiver is required to be connected to the phone line to make sure it is located in the correct location and that both tuners are being used (if that makes sense).

 

[James Long]

Please note, each DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 dual tuner receiver requires a constant phone line connection. Customers who do not have a phone line continually connected to their DISH 322 and DISH Player-DVR 522 receiver will have to pay a monthly programming access 4.99 per receiver.

If I put the pieces of the puzzle together correctly, I believe that Dish Network will be dropping the additional outlet fees on all receivers which are plugged into a phone line!

If true, I'll be activating my old 2700.

But reading the model numbers in your retailer doc quote, I'm not getting my hopes up.

I do wonder how much is reported over the phone line. I'm assuming that each box makes an occasional call to prove via Caller ID that it is in my home and to transfer any PPV info (of which there is none, since I don't do PPV). Obviously it uses my phoneline for the "Check My Account" option.

But does it report how long it has been connected to a satellite? If I were to connect my 2700 to a satellite then let it connect to a phone line would it say WHEN it had received a signal and what I watched? It currently doesn't receive any paid programming (nothing I pay for on my two 301's is viewable on the 2700) but will it report that it has seen a bird?

But reporting viewing habits on a subscribed receiver? It's that kind of paranoia that keeps boxes off of the phone line. My viewing habits are none of E*'s business as long as I'm paying for the channels I watch.

One thing for sure. Lift the per receiver fees and you will find a LOT of eBay receivers being added to homes as extras. I might even buy another receiver to fill out my eBay DP34 switch. I might even buy another DP34 and put four receivers on line. For $0 extra a month it would be worth hooking up my 2700 just for the music channels in the garage.

That's another reason why I don't believe it will happen. There is just too much money involved. Perhaps they want to make money selling additional receivers ... but giving up $60 per year per receiver is a lot of bottom line systemwide.

JL

 

[James Long]

According to the meeting in Charleston tonight they said that the 322 receiver is required to be connected to the phone line to make sure it is located in the correct location and that both tuners are being used (if that makes sense).

Why would they care if the second was *not* connected?

Odd.

JL