I have a few Fortec Universals and a few Sadoun Standards. I started to buy the Fortecs, because they fit into the Primestars (with the plastic neck of the lnb removed), and they seem to be 4 degrees apart when placed side by side (at least on IA5/AMC4) The Standards I like too, I can hose clamp them together a bit easier, but the plastic case was harder to get into for the Primestars.