Good place to buy a dish

[McGuyver]

(There's apparently something new on 129º, besides just Whitesprings.)

Thanks, I'll check it out

 

[SatelliteAV]

The GEOSATpro 90cm and the 3ABN reflector and masts are exactly the same and produced by the same manufacturer. There is no difference in metal thickness or metals. The bolts and other hardware are also identical.

The major differences in the two dishes are that the GEOSATpro has a thicker textured poly finish, an exclusive easy leveling mast that allows leveling in all directions (not just front to back), and a bubble spirit level that inserts in the mast to simplify installations. Starting next week, GEOSATpro 90cm dishes will be shipped with the LNBF Arm side support arms connected to the LNBF arm that is attached to the rear elevation butterfly bracket. Several years ago we tested the design that LNBF tripod arm design that 3ABN now distributes and found that heavy loads on the LNBF (like ice) would distort the reflector. For this reason, we chose to attach the LNBF arm to the elevation butterfly bracket for better support.

 

[Anole]

Amazing what one learns, when all the facts are known.

Thanks for the behind-the-scenes, SatAV :up



Those bulls-eye levels you stick in the end of the mast are sweet.
I just wish I could find mine.
Checked several hardware stores, and nobody carries 'em.

 

[starman345]

The GEOSATpro 90cm and the 3ABN reflector and masts are exactly the same and produced by the same manufacturer. There is no difference in metal thickness or metals. The bolts and other hardware are also identical.

The major differences in the two dishes are that the GEOSATpro has a thicker textured poly finish, an exclusive easy leveling mast that allows leveling in all directions (not just front to back), and a bubble spirit level that inserts in the mast to simplify installations. Starting next week, GEOSATpro 90cm dishes will be shipped with the LNBF Arm side support arms connected to the LNBF arm that is attached to the rear elevation butterfly bracket. Several years ago we tested the design that LNBF tripod arm design that 3ABN now distributes and found that heavy loads on the LNBF (like ice) would distort the reflector. For this reason, we chose to attach the LNBF arm to the elevation butterfly bracket for better support.

Brian,
Is there any chance of getting just a set of arms for my GeoSatPro90? I know it is off center, I was going to fashion some type of home made arms but if I could buy them, that would be simpler. I too like the spirit level in the mast end, makes plumbing the mast really easy.

 

[alfaromeo155]

I myself recently ordered from "3ABN.org" they are selling a good model with feed arm support brackets, it's almost identical to a GEOsat Pro 90cm dish except for the additional LNB feed arm support brackets. It uses the same LNB clamp bracket because it's made by the same mfg company. It also comes with a sturdy tripod style mount kit.

The price is only $50.00 with free shipping and only 3 states are charged tax, I paid under $54.00 for mine......CHECK 'EM OUT!!!
3ABN: Christian Television - Three Angels Broadcasting Network - www.3abn.org click on the "satellite" link in the menu bar and then scroll down. The picture is an actual photo of the real deal, it has there logo but who cares.

It's the 36" DISH KIT only, LNBF's are extra.

McGuyver, if you dont mind asking what is the elevation adjustment on the dish you ordered from 3ABN.org? Is it 0~90 degrees or different? and also does it come with all hardware needed to install like LNBF bracket, mounting brackets, etc. or something need to be ordered in addition? I have got LNBFs and the receiver, need a dish with the mounting harware. Please, let me know I will greatly appreciate this.

 

[McGuyver]

As per your request for more info

McGuyver, if you dont mind asking what is the elevation adjustment on the dish you ordered from 3ABN.org? Is it 0~90 degrees or different? and also does it come with all hardware needed to install like LNBF bracket, mounting brackets, etc. or something need to be ordered in addition? I have got LNBFs and the receiver, need a dish with the mounting harware. Please, let me know I will greatly appreciate this.

First of all, the (3ABN) elevation adjustment span is 10~70 degrees according to the scale on the bracket/clamp, the reason is that the elevation offset is a lower profile and doesn't aim as high as other dishes need to. It comes with the lnbf bracket and all neccessary hardware. The mounting mast that is included also comes with all needed hardware but the surface flange mount bolts are actually expanding anchors such as used for mounting into brick or concrete, if you need lag bolts, you will have to buy them, they are cheap and easy to find at any hardware store.

You should be good to go with this dish, just add the lnbf and a receiver but I strongly recommend the hardware upgrade that I mentioned because the factory dish bolts supplied are soft and will snap when tightened repeatidly during the elevation adjustment, I know because both broke on my GEOSATpro, not just one mind you but both!!! I live in a windy area and want my dish to stay put, so I chose to use quality SAE hardware that will take out the sloppy factory fit.

Second, the info that Satellite AV provided may NOT be completely accurate, I, by trade am a retired Machinist, Welder and Fabricator among other technical professions and I know my stuff, I used a Dial Caliper to measure the thickness and diameter of the mast pole and found the two to be different, the GEOSATpro does have a better design for leveling though and the bubble level isn't all that accurate either, neither is using a straight level on the side of the tubing, either one gives the same results. The downside of the GEOSATpro mounting mast (in my opinion) actually weakens the unit due to the enlarged or expanded slotting for the enhanced adjustment capabilities, they also use a thin stamped steel threaded insert at the base of the tube (unlike the 3ABN mast which uses shoulder bolts like the DSS designs) which is bound to strip out if over tightened and if you have a sloped roof you will most likely have to extend/file the adjustment slots to compensate like I had to, I did not have to with the 3ABN design.

I also did a slip fit of the two style masts into the same clamp and found the 3ABN mast to be a tighter fit, what does that tell you? It may be possible that the steel tubing materials used may not have come from the same vendor and this may be why, it's very common in the manufacturing industry for companies to buy materials from various suppliers or to change vendors midstream during a production series. I know this well because I used to be in the steel and welding industry and also manufacturing industries all of my life. When I first received my GEOSATpro dish, I asked myself; "Where's the BEEF?" The feed arm is a small square tube that measures about 7/8" square and is extremely thin, this is why it resonates like a guitar string. You must be careful when attaching the lnbf bracket, the tightening of the single bolt will crush the tubing.

The 3ABN design is a oval style tubing with the additional support brackets, it uses the same lnbf bracket though.
I myself made a replacement lnbf bracket from aluminum and a steel conduit strapping clamp which works superior to the plastic factory designed bracket, in fact I get a stronger signal possibly due to my custom aligning of the lnbf.

He also said that the GEOSATpro had a thicker poly coat which I found to be the same as the 3ABN, why would they be different if made by the same mfr? Doesn't make sense, I did notice a difference in weight though, the 3ABN reflector seems to be a bit heavier, don't ask me why, I may be wrong on this but it's not really important at the low price difference. I paid $70 plus shipping that came to approximately $90 from Adventist Satellite for my GEOSATpro and only $54 from 3ABN for a stiffer rigg.

Third, the 3ABN dish feed arm and support design is different and is not as weak as described by Satellite AV, after I assembled the dishes, I tugged on the feed arm and it did not flex in the slightest.

On the other hand, I can just touch the skinny feed arm on my GEOSATpro and it resonates like a guitar string. I have noticed in high winds that my signal will fluxuate and my picture will tile which does not happen with my other dishes. This is very aggrevating because I do a lot of recording. In fact, I actually retired the GEOSATpro dish for the time being, I will have to modify it by adding support arms to cure the problem. Why do you think he said that GEOSATpro is going to start adding supports? Because they too know that it's been a flaw in the design.

The 3ABN support arms are nearly the same size as the single feed arm on the GEOSATpro,,,,WOW!

One thing about 3ABN, they have always supplied a good dish to their viewers/customers. The dish I bought back in 2003 is a KTI and it's heavy, the reflector is thick steel and won't flex, they don't make 'em like that anymore in America. Too bad that KTI sold out and isn't making them anymore.

I hope this answers your questions and that you'll be satisfied with your new 3ABN dish.

 

[Anole]

ordering facts

I just had a short chat with a very nice lady at 3ABN.
You must ask for the Satellite Department to get to her.
Started out speaking to the Call Center, but they don't do dishes.

The dish is not drop-shipped by a 3rd party, as I had suspected.
They actually ship out of their own warehouse in southern Illinois.
If you do a web-order as I did, it may take another day or two to get the paperwork through accounting, and into the warehouse.

Otherwise it's: order one day, ship the next; nothing ships out on Friday.
She suggested you make a phone order with your credit card, as it'll get processed quicker.
And they don't usually email you a tracking number, but they will if you request it with your order.
Turns out, my dish is going out today, and they were happy to give me my UPS tracking number.
I'm guessing I'll have it about Monday or Tuesday, which would be a little under two weeks.

edit:
four hours later...
I found a business-cheque-sized-receipt in my mailbox. Real mail, as in US Mail. The Post.
The UPS tracking number is now valid, and by tomorrow I should be able to track.

six hours later ...
UPS is now saying Friday delivery. If so, that would be outstanding.

 

[SatelliteAV]

As the North American distribution partner for Azure Shine and coordinating OEM purchases of the Azure Shine product, I stand by the statements on the differences between the GEOSATpro and 3ABN dishes. We are not providing this information to promote purchase from one vendor over another, but posting to provide accurate information. 3ABN dishes may have recently upgraded the finish from the smooth semi-gloss to the thicker textured charcoal finish, but I have not tested one of their dishes shipped in the last 3 or 4 months.

Yes, the dishes may be from the same manufacturer, but as an OEM product the purchaser has the option to upgrade or downgrade accessories, hardware and coatings to adjust product cost. The metal thickness mentioned on the items are identically spec'd in the purchase orders.

The tripod type LNBF arms were developed several years ago as a cost cutting design for lowering the hardware cost. It was not designed to overcome defect. The existing GEOSATpro LNBF tube arm design is more then adequate for single standard LNBF installations, but with the upcoming Glorystar dual and quad output, 4 degree spaced, monoblock LNBFs, the placement of the LNBF is highly critical. We are modifying our current design to provide more accurate placement of the LNBFs and to provide better rigidity if the arms are subjected to snow and ice build-up.

We will be selling a LNBF arm upgrades for existing dishes as soon as the shipment arrives. A single hole will need to be drilled in the LNBF arm to mount the side arms on previously purchased dishes.

Azure Shine dishes are very well designed and a very high quality dish. The finish and performance are much higher than similarly priced dishes from every other foreign manufacturer of steel dishes.

 

[alfaromeo155]

you might be rigth SatelliteAv, but $50.00 shipped for the 90 cm dish is hard to beat. Maybe you can waive the shipping charge then I will be more then willing to buy the GeoSatPro dish and a few more things from you.

 

[Anole]

ouch !

SatAV has been nothing but polite and helpful.
Not only in this thread, but in others.

Some time ago, I asked him about a deal I found and inquired if he might have anything similar in the future.
(...and said that I really preferred doing business with him)
He replied that I'd found a below-wholesale-clearance, and should go for it.

Whenever he's disclosed behind-the-scene info in the industry, it's always been illuminating.
...as in this thread...

I really think a little more respect is due.

 

[CharredPC]

McGuyver- This $50 deal sounds great for my needs! If I read correctly, it comes with a mounting kit / mast. Would you trust the mount to hold up a motor as well (say, an SG2100), and the dish LNB arm to hold up an INVACOM QPH-031? The price for all that individually looks to be cheaper than any combo deal I've found yet. Shipping HURTS!

Anole- Thanks for your helpful ordering info! I don't think McGuyver meant any disrespect towards Satellite AV. We all know they rock, but occasionally a better deal can be found elsewhere, for whatever reason. I was able to follow what he said about thickness and design (I've worked in steel and wire mills for years); his deductions appear pretty sound IMHO. I guess the real test will be how both dishes hold up over the next 5-10 years

 

[McGuyver]

No Disrespect Intended.....

SatAV has been nothing but polite and helpful.
Not only in this thread, but in others.

Some time ago, I asked him about a deal I found and inquired if he might have anything similar in the future.
(...and said that I really preferred doing business with him)
He replied that I'd found a below-wholesale-clearance, and should go for it.

Whenever he's disclosed behind-the-scene info in the industry, it's always been illuminating.
...as in this thread...

I really think a little more respect is due.

I truly never meant any disrespect for Brian/SatelliteAV, I am merely stating my own factual findings and passing on information to you people in order for you to improve on a product and/or to make a better choice in purchasing a dish kit. Brian has been very informative and his statements are truly professional, no doubt.

I'm always looking for ways to improve on something where I find flaws or imperfections, I'm a perfectionist I've been told whether it's good or bad....

I'm sure if I was to buy one of the 3ABN dishes for myself, which I plan to do before they're gone, I would find ways to improve it also. I already know of only one area I would and that's the LNBF bracket, it's made of plastic and might not hold up in severe hot temps and long exposure to UV rays. I fear that it may sagg and cause misalignment of the LNBF. It gets very hot here in the desert, lately it's been upto 114 degrees and actually got upto 120 July 4th weekend.

I apologize to Brian if I showed any disrespect. Here that Brian? I mean it and hope you forgive me

 

[McGuyver]

My Advice offered

McGuyver- This $50 deal sounds great for my needs! If I read correctly, it comes with a mounting kit / mast. Would you trust the mount to hold up a motor as well (say, an SG2100), and the dish LNB arm to hold up an INVACOM QPH-031? The price for all that individually looks to be cheaper than any combo deal I've found yet. Shipping HURTS!

Anole- Thanks for your helpful ordering info! I don't think McGuyver meant any disrespect towards Satellite AV. We all know they rock, but occasionally a better deal can be found elsewhere, for whatever reason. I was able to follow what he said about thickness and design (I've worked in steel and wire mills for years); his deductions appear pretty sound IMHO. I guess the real test will be how both dishes hold up over the next 5-10 years

Yes, it includes a mast kit, quite sturdy for it's smaller diameter of 42mm, I'm not familiar with the SG2100 motor or how much it weighs nor the post size compatibility, you'll need to do that research. It would never hurt to improve on anything if you feel it needs more support. I would not recommend using the factory plastic LNBF bracket, I made a simple aluminum bracket for my GEOSATpro that works perfect, I would recommend doing the same for a 3ABN dish if you use the Invacom. The arm and supports themself are very rigid and will easily support the weight.

I will make it a point to post some pics and dimensions of my LNBF bracket fab so that you guys can improve your dish too. Check back in the next day or so for it.

As I posted earlier, I didn't mean any disrespect towards Brian at all, I appreciate his facts and opinions. I was only conveying the true facts of my findings. Talk to ya later

 

[lumpkin666]

As I posted earlier, I didn't mean any disrespect towards Brian at all, I appreciate his facts and opinions. I was only conveying the true facts of my findings. Talk to ya later

Maybe I am misreading things, but I didn't see anything disrespectful in your communications. I had figured that Anole was aiming his comments at alfaromeo155's last comments.

 

[alfaromeo155]

Maybe I am misreading things, but I didn't see anything disrespectful in your communications. I had figured that Anole was aiming his comments at alfaromeo155's last comments.

If you think mine was disrespectful then I apologize, I didn't even think that someone will get offended by what I wrote, I had absolutely no intention to offend anybody. I was gonna order a dish and a LNBF brackets from SatteliteAV before I found the cheaper dish. The only thing I had in mind maybe I will get some sort of a deal match or whatever you want to call it, but if you guys understood it otherwise, I am really sorry, take my words back.

 

[McGuyver]

Whewwww!!!

Maybe I am misreading things, but I didn't see anything disrespectful in your communications. I had figured that Anole was aiming his comments at alfaromeo155's last comments.

I'm glad to hear that I wasn't offensive and I myself didn't sense any disrespect from alfaromeo155 either. Jestures can't be expressed on these boards and some people might read into them differently.

All in all, it sounds like everything is cool!

Hey, I'll have the pics up in just a short while, I just came down from the roof and cooling off in the house while I work on this.

 

[dishMIKE]

Brian what actual day this week will the new support arms be included with the Geosatpro 90cm dish? Thanks, Mike

 

[McGuyver]

Home made LNBF Bracket

Here is a photo and drawing of the LNBF bracket.


EDIT: I revised the drawing and posted it here, I made a few changes for better adjustment for fine tuning.

 

[Anole]

Damn, now I feel like an ass for making a stink out of the whole thing!

McG - love the LNB holder.
I'd say that would survive the high desert temps, so long as the LNB did!
I don't see where the side arms attach, though.
And I sort of thought the original LNB holder is where they all came together.
Oh, maybe I'm thinking of the Primestar/ChannelMaster dishes...

Guess I'll have to wait and see how my sample dish looks when it's delivered this Friday.
As long as it'll support my Invacom, I'll try it as is, unless it seems really flimsy.
My Fortec 36" LNB holder is plastic, but I don't anticipate any early failure of it...

Looking forward to a darker charcoal dish like the GeoSats
My white Fortec is . . . bold . . . to say the least.
. . . and I've already purchased a can of grey primer spray paint . . .

My roof has a speckled tan/white/yellow/black color.
If I were to get some broom straws and fling those colors onto a dish, I'd bet it would disappear against the roof!

edit:
Just read your document.
Very good and very comprehensive.
I now see the existing holes in the main LNB support arm, for attaching the side arms.

I wonder how far between your bracket bend and the original LNB bracket hole in the arm?

Those conduit hanger brackets are exceptional for LNB mounting. :up

 

[McGuyver]

Reply....

Damn, now I feel like an ass for making a stink out of the whole thing!

McG - love the LNB holder.
I'd say that would survive the high desert temps, so long as the LNB did!
I don't see where the side arms attach, though.
And I sort of thought the original LNB holder is where they all came together.
Oh, maybe I'm thinking of the Primestar/ChannelMaster dishes...

Guess I'll have to wait and see how my sample dish looks when it's delivered this Friday.
As long as it'll support my Invacom, I'll try it as is, unless it seems really flimsy.
My Fortec 36" LNB holder is plastic, but I don't anticipate any early failure of it...

Looking forward to a darker charcoal dish like the GeoSats
My white Fortec is . . . bold . . . to say the least.
. . . and I've already purchased a can of grey primer spray paint . . .

My roof has a speckled tan/white/yellow/black color.
If I were to get some broom straws and fling those colors onto a dish, I'd bet it would disappear against the roof!

edit:
Just read your document.
Very good and very comprehensive.
I now see the existing holes in the main LNB support arm, for attaching the side arms.

I wonder how far between your bracket bend and the original LNB bracket hole in the arm?

Those conduit hanger brackets are exceptional for LNB mounting. :up

Hi Anole,,,The dish in the photo is my GEOSATpro (charcoal color) that doesn't have the support arms. The 3ABN dish is light gray color, (no photo of it yet). Remember the small pic on their website? It's just like that. I would prefer light gray colors because of heat distortion and signal wave bending, I would only guess that it may effect the signal during the heat of the day. In fact, I have noticed a more stable TV picture image in the cool of the evening and noticable glitches during the daytime heat. The charcoal dish gets so hot that you can't touch it, the light gray stays relatively cool.

You could "Fleck Paint" it to match your roof though....

The 3ABN feed arm isn't square either, it's sort of oval shaped but uses the same lnbf bracket as the GEOSATpro and possibly the Fortec Dish. The 3ABN dish support arms attach very close to the lnbf bracket and still allowing room for attaching the aluminum bracket.

The bend in the flat bar bracket is almost on the edge of the feed arm tubing, not more than 1/16" beyond, the factory bolt hole is most likely the same distance as your Fortec, approx 3/4" from the end, just look at the plastic bracket on your Fortec.

The bend needs to be as close as possible to the end to maintain the proper height for the lnbf alignment/focal point. If you make your own bracket, just measure so that the bend is right at the end of the feed arm tube. You can also elongate the 2 holes in the flat bracket so that it can slide up and down for more adjustment ability.

My drawing is based on the 3ABN dish with support arms and the photo is to only illustrate the fabricated bracket, I don't mean to confuse you guys. Both dishes use the same basic dimensions such as the angle of the arm which sets the lnbf on a 45 degree slant, therefore the bracket will work on either dish assy. You will only have to drill one hole in the feed arm for the second bolt in the bracket.