D* Killing E* now in HD

[richiephx]

Don't try to confuse the confusees with fact

 

[Kb Cool]

I think the 4 hd channel per transponder speculation came from specification of the 'Harmonic's DiviCom Electra 7000 Encoder provides up to four channels of superior quality constant bit rate (CBR) or variable bit rate (VBR) MPEG-4 AVC (H.264) video'. Also I think Scott wrote he has a channel transponder list of DirecTV 10
Harmonic Inc. | Press Release
http://www.harmonicinc.com/view_collateral.cfm?ID=3097

Pretty sure the Electra 7000 is just the rack mount configuration of the encorder and it does not include the multiplexers. All I've read so far is that 7Mbps for HD MPEG-4 AVC is optimal and any higher bite rate would be over kill.

Maybe it's more like 8Mbps.

HBO to use MPEG-4 and mandate a minimum bit-rate - Engadget HD

 

[HokieEngineer]

I think the 4 hd channel per transponder speculation came from specification of the 'Harmonic's DiviCom Electra 7000 Encoder provides up to four channels of superior quality constant bit rate (CBR) or variable bit rate (VBR) MPEG-4 AVC (H.264) video'. Also I think Scott wrote he has a channel transponder list of DirecTV 10
Harmonic Inc. | Press Release
http://www.harmonicinc.com/view_collateral.cfm?ID=3097

Pretty sure the Electra 7000 is just the rack mount configuration of the encorder and it does not include the multiplexers. All I've read so far is that 7Mbps for HD MPEG-4 AVC is optimal and any higher bite rate would be over kill.

Yea I was just on their website the other day. What I found interesting was on the main product page it states you can do 5-6 h.264 channels on a 8psk transponder.

Harmonic Inc. | Compression

I'm betting they came out with a firmware upgrade or a newer rev of the E7000, which is why Dish is slowly transitioning all of their 4 channel TPs to 6 channels. Bottom line is there are not many vendors of this type of hardware and both Dish and Direct are the guinea pigs doing real world testing for harmonic and crew .

 

[Digital Dude]

Bottom line is that I have 2-622's and 2-211's at a cost of $200. And I've watched HD almost exclusivly for the past year while DirecTV had 9 HD channels. It'll take $800 and a few years to get the same amount of HD into my eyes on Direc as I've had from Dish.

 

[Kb Cool]

Yea I was just on their website the other day. What I found interesting was on the main product page it states you can do 5-6 h.264 channels on a 8psk transponder.

Harmonic Inc. | Compression

I'm betting they came out with a firmware upgrade or a newer rev of the E7000, which is why Dish is slowly transitioning all of their 4 channel TPs to 6 channels. Bottom line is there are not many vendors of this type of hardware and both Dish and Direct are the guinea pigs doing real world testing for harmonic and crew .

Bottom line also is what ever DISH is doing to the HD channels now is. "They don't look that great" Sure it still looks good. But I am not seeing that "looking out a window" affect that I seen before on DISH and 4DTV.

 

[JimK2]

AND THIS MIGHT GET PEOPLE GOING TO D* AS WELL :
News Briefs: Charlie Backs Hillary
MISCELLANY -- EchoStar CEO Charlie Ergen, along with company co-founders Candy Ergen and Jim DeFranco said they are supporting Sen. Hillary Clinton (D-N.Y.) in her campaign for the presidency in 2008. The company is encouraging its retailers to support the senator's run as well, urging them to donate $2,300 to Clinton's campaign. If dealers comply, they'll get an invitation to a fund-raising event Oct. 23 at Ergen's home. What a deal.

5/14/2007
Charlie Ergen gave $2,300 to John McCain and Candy Ergen also gave another $2,300 to John McCain total $4600

 

[kb7oeb]

Ugh. Charlie's probably already penciled in for a night or two in the Lincoln bedroom sometime in 2009. The White House should be clean and tidy after George and Laura leave, but Charlie better plan his stay as early as possible before Bill stains the place again.

I am resting the urge to respond to this and would prefer a mod delete all the political posts from this thread.

 

[HokieEngineer]

Lets keep the posts on topic folks.

 

[kb7oeb]

Ouch

Dish is overcharging for HD access, Directv is $10 and local cable is $4 more expensive STB or no extra charge if your using cable card. I think Dish should eliminate the $20 HD fee , merge voom into regular packages and use the existing $6 HD enable fee to turn on the HD versions of channels you have subscription to.

That graphics lists "Monsers", I don't think anyone anywhere has heard of that one

 

[drdroo]

In our market the HD box is like 14 a month for cable, for less channels. If you want a DVR, you usually pay even more, plus the fact that my cable plan (with 3 regular STBs, regular digital and HBO/Starz) was about 40 bucks more a month than my arrangement with Dish. It's still at least 20$ more now that I'm paying 15$ more (I saved money with DVR advantage) than i was a few months ago. They charge for cablecards monthly here too.

It can be worse.. Something like 60% of this state has cable and several markets have digital but no bi-directional services or HD. My grandfather in VT has digital through charter, cable Internet, but no HD, On Demand, etc. He now has Cable Internet and DishHD..

My point was that some cable companies are nicer than others. They may entice with promos (like Dish does with the 6 months free HD and the free DVR), but ultimately the promos go away. Some of those cable cos are giving 6 months of cheap/free services but it's an 18 month contract for Tripleplay.

I'm not against paying less, but I don't feel that the 'others' are necessarily better to my wallet overall either..

 

[JimK2]

Maybe it's more like 8Mbps.

HBO to use MPEG-4 and mandate a minimum bit-rate - Engadget HD

Zitter said HBO would be transmitting at 8 megabits-per-second, including an allotment of about 1 mbps for "overhead." This puts the audio/video transmit payload for quality levels acceptable by HBO at around 7 mbps,
HBO Move to MPEG-4 Opens Door to Big Changes in Cable > Screenplays Magazine > Flash Points

 

[uncrules]

I can confirm the Dish numbers, but not the resolutions on the Directv channels. It has been rumored they are full resolution though.

My guess: I doubt you will see much difference between Dish and Direct's h.264 (mpeg4) channels. Although if Dish is doing one more format conversion (1920x1080 -> 1440x1080) than Direct I'd imagine the PQ would be a tad softer.

From a staff member on this site, goaliebob99, who switched from E* to D*

Now to The HD lite portion of the review. Directv needs to bring all there mpg2 channels out of HD lite mode and into full glory mpg4 mode. This was noticeable with the mpg2 version of HBO and the mpg4 version of it. Now to the movie channels in MPEG4. WOW, WHERE WAS THIS ON DISH! I AM VERY IMPRESSED! This is literally the most beautiful picture that I have seen since the days of pre hdlite. IF this is directv's future then Directv subs have a very bright future. DIRECTV'S HD PICTURE ON THESE CHANNELS BLOWS DISH NETWORK RIGHT OUT OF THE WATER! That was a side by side comparison on the same TV, same resolution between dish and Directv. My wife even said she noticed a major difference. With Directv the picture seems sharper where as dish is softer. Also, I gained double the movie channels in HD than what I had with dish.

http://www.satelliteguys.us/directv-forum/110836-24-hours-directv-here-my-review.html

 

[Islandguy43]

I tried to cancel during free preview on the first day of the season, mostly so I could switch over to the three month plan and they hassled me about it. They finally took it off, but I only think because it was in free preview, even though the letter said the same. The free preview remained and I resubscribed and paid the extra $20 but now I'm trying to see what the cost of moving to D* and keeping E* just for c.i., hd receiver, and sd dvr (maybe). Any thoughts?

The clincher for me is the NHL Network (perferably in HD). If E* adds that channel before the end of the month, I will stay until the end of the season and then evaluate the offers. D* very is tempting right now, especially since they already offer the Bflo area channels in hd (E* doesnt'); and they are gonna add MSG-HD (Bflo games covered by MSG - and E*). D*'s cost of their HD dvr figures in the equation too. $200 for the dvr buys the CI package and more from E*. So if D* was really very interested in cultivating E* HD subscribers, they would make us offers to really open our eyes.

 

[Islandguy43]

Ouch is right. Now if D* would give us a free hd dvr, that would be close to a knockout punch.

 

[darrencp22]

Ouch is right. Now if D* would give us a free hd dvr, that would be close to a knockout punch.

I know a lot of people here believe that Dish can do no wrong. But that ad is completely true. You're right.. if the DVR were free and I didnt have a commitment to NHL CI, i might be calling D* after another disapointing uplink report.

 

[Kb Cool]

Zitter said HBO would be transmitting at 8 megabits-per-second, including an allotment of about 1 mbps for "overhead." This puts the audio/video transmit payload for quality levels acceptable by HBO at around 7 mbps,
HBO Move to MPEG-4 Opens Door to Big Changes in Cable > Screenplays Magazine > Flash Points

Thanks for pointing that out. Now I just hope we get some of those Mpeg4 HBOHD channels when launched. All of them would be nice. But, I am not holding my breath as we are not even getting all the HBO channels that are available in SD as it stands now. But 7 of them would be nice.

 

[sprintcarcrazy]

Not me, I have used Directs HD DVR, wouldn't be ready to take a step back in time. I have been enjoying a ton of HD for over a year !!!

 

[stuckingoo]

Ouch is right. Now if D* would give us a free hd dvr, that would be close to a knockout punch.

No chance of that happening. However, swing a decent deal with a CSR (conservatively, $199 for the HR20) then tack on monthly programming and hardware rebates currently available and the install turns out to be free after a year.

Is the HR20 inferior to the 622? Yes. Is it a huge gap? No. And in the course of the past year, the HR20 has become very stable. I actually had more issues with the 622.

PQ. No contest. D*. Content. Ditto. When I had Dish I had to surf around to find something in HD to watch (not a Voom fan). With D*, the problem is choosing among many good choices. There is certainly stretchovision but there is also great legit HD content like Smithsonian and the HD converted movies on the MGM channel.

BTW, I'm also a CI subscriber. I think the slight advantage E* has over D* with respect to home/away feeds and HD content (minimal advantage as the new Conus HD RSNs come online as we speak) can evidently be a big thing if you are a hockey nut. But I am a hockey nut too and it doesn't matter to me nearly as much as it seems to matter to others.

 

[coltrane679]

I'll evaluate the situation after Center Ice expires (late spring)--that will also be the time to hop in for the baseball package I miss.

If Charlie hasn't gotten in the game by them, or sold to a buyer who makes it clear they will, E* is never going to. Wanting to be the Wal-mart of satellite TV is fine, but you aren't going to attract the folks who want the high end. So at the end of the day we might see the E* dishes dominating the trailer parks and rednecks in the sticks, with D* prevailing everywhere else.

 

[KAB]

I'll evaluate the situation after Center Ice expires (late spring)--that will also be the time to hop in for the baseball package I miss.

If Charlie hasn't gotten in the game by them, or sold to a buyer who makes it clear they will, E* is never going to. Wanting to be the Wal-mart of satellite TV is fine, but you aren't going to attract the folks who want the high end. So at the end of the day we might see the E* dishes dominating the trailer parks and rednecks in the sticks, with D* prevailing everywhere else.

Careful what you do from here on out. There may be a redneck close by.